[Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

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Howdareme
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[Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by Howdareme » Sun Jun 22, 2014 5:13 pm

Will drastic ever support non buffered rendering like ppsspp or something similar? Would be a pretty nice touch playing games in glorious HD *-*

Exophase
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by Exophase » Mon Jun 23, 2014 11:17 am

I'm not totally sure what non-buffered rendering is, but I think it's only really applicable to PPSSPP..

If you mean rendering in higher resolutions then there's two things on that: one, we don't have any intention to try to use 3D acceleration for rendering graphics because that causes a lot of problems and performance issues with DS emulation. Two, we do have plans to try supporting a mode where the emulator renders to 512x384 instead of 256x192, but since it's rendered in software it will be very demanding and will probably only work well on high end devices. I doubt we'd even try to support higher resolutions than that.

zxcvbad
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by zxcvbad » Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:25 am

Exophase, option 2 sounds nice :P is it a long term goal or you already working on it? Curious what regression in performance is to expect, would be really interesting to test it on even higher resolution, like 3x, since it's software, upcoming Aarch64 could be helpful. Another great hardware for tests would be jetson tk1, Cortex-A15 is still limited but a newer revision and higher frequency

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kaikun97
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by kaikun97 » Tue Jul 01, 2014 2:35 pm

Exophase wrote:I'm not totally sure what non-buffered rendering is, but I think it's only really applicable to PPSSPP..

If you mean rendering in higher resolutions then there's two things on that: one, we don't have any intention to try to use 3D acceleration for rendering graphics because that causes a lot of problems and performance issues with DS emulation. Two, we do have plans to try supporting a mode where the emulator renders to 512x384 instead of 256x192, but since it's rendered in software it will be very demanding and will probably only work well on high end devices. I doubt we'd even try to support higher resolutions than that.
Id love to see 512x384 res rendering added. My phone would probaly be handle that playable with some frameskip (currently most games are full 60fps with frameskip turned off and my CPU is fast)

Causality
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by Causality » Sat Jul 12, 2014 4:37 pm

Exophase wrote:I'm not totally sure what non-buffered rendering is, but I think it's only really applicable to PPSSPP..

If you mean rendering in higher resolutions then there's two things on that: one, we don't have any intention to try to use 3D acceleration for rendering graphics because that causes a lot of problems and performance issues with DS emulation. Two, we do have plans to try supporting a mode where the emulator renders to 512x384 instead of 256x192, but since it's rendered in software it will be very demanding and will probably only work well on high end devices. I doubt we'd even try to support higher resolutions than that.
May as well have the option, though, even if it's buried deep in the menus. I know the "Wow this DS emulator runs at 60fps on my Ti-83" headlines are nice, but there are people with overclocked Shields and Note 3s champing at the bit for something to sink their teeth into. Maybe a developer/tweaker mode you can only enable with the manual editing of a file with a root explorer.

Exophase
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by Exophase » Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:10 pm

Did you read the post you were responding to? :P I already said, we have plans to try stuff with this. I don't have a problem with it being an option that's easy to enable for whoever wants to, that's not the issue. It's something that needs actual work to implement, it's not a trivial change. And it will only be with software rendering, we're not doing anything with 3D acceleration.

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kaikun97
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by kaikun97 » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:30 am

Exophase wrote:Did you read the post you were responding to? :P I already said, we have plans to try stuff with this. I don't have a problem with it being an option that's easy to enable for whoever wants to, that's not the issue. It's something that needs actual work to implement, it's not a trivial change. And it will only be with software rendering, we're not doing anything with 3D acceleration.
Why not? you can use open gl for 3d acceleration. nds4droid works with it along with practically every windows ds emukator and with most gpus in phones it wont be an issue. Rendering jusy 3D graphics in open gl could work. if you just use software the whole time we'll never be able to get high quality or hi red rendring and uts something a lot of us want now

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huckleberrypie
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by huckleberrypie » Sun Jul 13, 2014 2:44 am

kaikun97 wrote:
Exophase wrote:Did you read the post you were responding to? :P I already said, we have plans to try stuff with this. I don't have a problem with it being an option that's easy to enable for whoever wants to, that's not the issue. It's something that needs actual work to implement, it's not a trivial change. And it will only be with software rendering, we're not doing anything with 3D acceleration.
Why not? you can use open gl for 3d acceleration. nds4droid works with it along with practically every windows ds emukator and with most gpus in phones it wont be an issue. Rendering jusy 3D graphics in open gl could work. if you just use software the whole time we'll never be able to get high quality or hi red rendring and uts something a lot of us want now
He blamed it on how unusually complex the DS' 3D subsystem is.

Speaking of which, is it true that scenes are limited to like a thousand or so polys/vertices?

Jay Haru
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by Jay Haru » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:02 am

kaikun97 wrote:
Exophase wrote:Did you read the post you were responding to? :P I already said, we have plans to try stuff with this. I don't have a problem with it being an option that's easy to enable for whoever wants to, that's not the issue. It's something that needs actual work to implement, it's not a trivial change. And it will only be with software rendering, we're not doing anything with 3D acceleration.
Why not? you can use open gl for 3d acceleration. nds4droid works with it along with practically every windows ds emukator and with most gpus in phones it wont be an issue. Rendering jusy 3D graphics in open gl could work. if you just use software the whole time we'll never be able to get high quality or hi red rendring and uts something a lot of us want now
And just think how fast nds4droid is. Iirc, the reason its not implemented is coz the ds has a weird way of doing 2d-3d and isn't really using the opengl standard thus using it could potentially hurt speed/playability. Just coz others use it doesn't mean we have to bandwagon. Desmume still has to rely on powerful cpus for most games to play (I dare anyone to use it on old pentium 4s).

If the expert on the matter already said it should be sw rendering, then he must have a valid reason as he knows more than we users may know on the subject matter.
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kaikun97
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Re: [Q] Will Drastic ever support non-buffered rendering?

Post by kaikun97 » Sun Jul 13, 2014 3:04 am

huckleberrypie wrote:
kaikun97 wrote:
Exophase wrote:Did you read the post you were responding to? :P I already said, we have plans to try stuff with this. I don't have a problem with it being an option that's easy to enable for whoever wants to, that's not the issue. It's something that needs actual work to implement, it's not a trivial change. And it will only be with software rendering, we're not doing anything with 3D acceleration.
Why not? you can use open gl for 3d acceleration. nds4droid works with it along with practically every windows ds emukator and with most gpus in phones it wont be an issue. Rendering jusy 3D graphics in open gl could work. if you just use software the whole time we'll never be able to get high quality or hi red rendring and uts something a lot of us want now
He blamed it on how unusually complex the DS' 3D subsystem is.

Speaking of which, is it true that scenes are limited to like a thousand or so polys/vertices?
abeit the fact open gl works fine on nds4droid, just a little slow becaecause of nds4drpid being unoptimised

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